[oldchina]

Stoneowl: the problems just don't seem to go away, do they?

You display a lot of patience in setting things out in your careful and calm way. And yet some people claim that they aren't experiencing any problems with the 5800. How strange that Nokia do not seem to be able to achieve consistency with this product.

Anyway, I have now gone back to using an old N82 (comfortably reliable) as my temporary main phone, but it won't last forever, and I haven't been able to find any more new ones on the market (no "parallel imports", please). So I am now trying an Android based phone: quite nice, and very reliable.

The 5800 isn't even backup any longer, ever since the screen seemed to desensitise somewhat. Nokia Care Centre merely suggested that I shouldn't expect an immediate response to every single screen press...and told me that as they couldn't consistently replicate the problem, they couldn't really do anything about it. Oh yes, software reinstalled, again.

What a pity: I think that the 5800 could have been a rather nice device, if it wasn't for the sort of glitches you so accurately set out.

[chanchan05]

I really don't understand it too. Why so many people have gripes with Nokia products mainly due to inconsistency in quality. I have a perfectly functioning 5800XM. Never hanged up (well once, when I had like 0.5mb left on phone memory because I installed all my apps on it), but here I see a lot of people with problems. Of course people with problems are more likely to gravitate to forums seeking help than those who dont have problems. Even when I had my old phone, the 5610, a lot of people were complaining about glitches but I never had one. Maybe I'm just lucky or something. None of the phones I've ever bought experienced software or hardware problems which I did not cause myself (basically the unit falling from a table, breaking the flex, etc), but nothing from the Nokia end.

Although I do realize, smartphones almost always have glitches when released. I've yet to hear of any smartphone released where no one had any sort of complaint regarding hardware or software. Even the Iphone with its vaunted stability has the comatose problem resulting to the same amount of cursing that the n97 receives. Even SE has a lot of issues with the Satio, and Samsung received a lot of complaints on the Omnia HD.

Maybe, for all the people having gripes with the smartphone bugs, why dont you sort of buy the high end dummyphones (6700, w995, Tocco, etc). That is if you dont need the smartphone apps. I mean those things have wifi and GPS, as well, and 3G, and EDGE, and somesuch. Only the OS is different. And they have infinitely less bugs than smartphones. Its just a suggestion if possible. Of course you have your reasons for buying smartphones, but I was wondering, why buy a smartphone when you know you'd get the bugs?

The best policy I found (which a me and mod from another cellphone help forum share), is to never buy a smartphone that is less than 6 months old, or is yet to recieve its first major update. And no, 6months is not a long time in cellphone age. Each phone is technically useable and updated for two years of use. The n95 had a two year lifespan of being useful. Even up to now it can go head to head with a lot of the newer phones. Featurewise I'd still take it over the Iphone 3GS.

The 5800 could have been a great phone. It had the potential. However it was released with s smartphone OS, and thus received the curse of the smartphone as well. The 5800 will be a year old next month. Hopefully, with the impending release of the 5800 NaviEd, we'll see it receive a stable and ultimately useable firmware. Or else the NaviEd isnt likely to sell. 

[stoneowl]

Hi chanchan05,

thanks for sharing your thoughts. And I do congratulate you for not having a single problem with the phone at all.

But I am a bit confused by your post though.

You mentioned your phone is perfect, and recognize that any faults you have is due to your own doing. But don't mind me being skeptical, but I think you are just accepting things as it is directly.

This I agree, but yes I've been trying to say, the 5800 is a phone (quite a good one in terms of quality, make etc) weighted down by a immature software that did not stand up to the "Connecting People" philosophy.  Functionality that lost touch with reality. Yes, of course I can give up the good old efficient way of doing things like sending text, making phone calls and switch to some other ways that seems illogical, doesn't make sense etc. Not that I don't like to learn new stuff, but I just don't feel right to learn something that seems to regress in progress.

You mentioned that we must understand all smartphones have inherent faults, even the ones that people champion around here as a good alternative. So you recognize smartphones, being too powerful in functionality has a lot of problems. And you said that since 5800 is lumped together as a smartphone, people just have to accept that 5800 seems to have faults.

Well, you said it, 5800 has faults.

I'm still amazed at your luck for getting phones that never has problems.

Mine has problems, but I try my best to live with it, hoping that they get solved in the shortest possible time coz like what you said, the usable period is just about 2 years ( 6 months for it to be out of the latest fad). 

So you suggest never buy a smartphone below 6 months coz it is problematic? I tend to agree, but sometimes it's like buying a fashion trend. A phone is still a phone, then why are we changing phone. We could have stuck with the classic 3210 (damn lasting phone which I still keep in for memory sake). Still working, though the functionality is way off what we have now. But to call and text, it still serves the purpose.

Just wondering, did you buy the 5800 within 6 months or after 6 months? the 5800 is coming to a year old, I had mine for 9 months ( it took 3 months before it was release in my country). Yes, I agree, the updates did attempt to solve some 'teething problems' like what everyone said. But with one more year of usability, it is really going to be a perfect phone when it is at the end of it's usability period.

With one statement "The 5800 could have been a great phone. It had the potential.", you just admitted that 5800 is not a great phone, it is only a phone that could have been great. It had the potential, but it lost the potential with each passing day isn't it?

One point, I read that someone defended Nokia on the issue of kinetic scrolling, saying "did you see the advertising saying it had kinetic scrolling? as far as the advertising goes, Nokia has given all that they say the phone will do"

I totally agree with that statement. I did not say Nokia cheated anyone.

But I have to say, did any of the other touch screen phone's advertising, or specs sheets say things like

1) Comes along with kinetic scrolling 

2) Texting that doesn't make sense (referring to my first few posts problems)

3) Browser available (but drops connection faster that than you can drop your phone)

4) Alarm that rings as and when it feels like it.

Believe me when I say, when users buy a phone, alarms, how to text, kinetic scrolling isn't a buying factor. Would you buy a alarm clock and ask the sales person, does this alarm clock really sound the alarm on time, or as and when it feels like it?

My point being, we have progress to the stage whereby somethings are defacto standards, widely accepted worldwide. And being "The World's Largest Cellphone Maker", "The Leader In The Market", "The Highest Market Share In The World for Cellphones", "The Company THat is Suing App!e over patents of technologies", I believe all these overlooked faults, functionality is really "THe Worlds Largest Joke", "The Biggest Slap In The Face".

Any I don't think "Yes, we've solved all these problems. All these features you like which is not in your current phone, is now in our latest NaviEd of your phone. So go buy it!". Within 2 years?

It's perfect for sales. Coz you can sell the same product twice. 

If not, that Nokia thinks that the users are blinded by the company's name, and will lap up anything they throw at us.

[stoneowl]

Thanks for the post ravidavi,

Glad to see that you are using the most of out of your phone.

Don't ever get me wrong, I did not say it's a bad phone. Like what you mentioned,  it's just needs to catch up with it's little 5530.

Anyway, just to let you know. All the functionalities you mention, if they were not working for you as promised by Nokia, you'll be in a different camp.

The cursing and swearing camp. But to get the functionalities as promised, frankly I believe that is what you bought the phone for, isn't it?

cheers 

[spikey]

any help for my querry??

[chanchan05]

@stoneowl

I'll address your confusion to my post.

1. Smartphones has faults - Yes, it is very common for smartphones to have faults. And yes the 5800 has its faults as shown by this very thread. But that does not mean that EVERY single one of them has faults. What I was trying to say is that buying a smartphone has a greater risk of getting bugs than buying a dummyphone. Its like when you buy a smartphone, you have a 50/50 chance of getting a buggy or a not buggy unit.

2. Yes I suggest not buying smartphones for at least 6months after release. From what I have seen for all brands, they release a major update for the phone within the next 6months after its release (take the upcoming v2 firmware for the n97 which is less than 6mos old, or the v20 for the 5800 a few months back, as the most recent examples). That is if you are buying a top of the line phone (the 5800 is top xpressmusic, the n97 is top dog of all nokia). If you notice, only the top of the line dogs for every lineup nokia has experiences the glitches, mainly because of the many functions. The n85, n79, n86 do not have as much problems as the n97, comparable to the way the 5730, 5630, 5320 does not have the same number of 5800 problems. Buying phones as a fashion trend for me is just well, pointless.

3. As for the potential. Yes it had potential. But hardware discrepancies made it less than what it could have been. The 3.2mp camera with dual led and autofocus looked great on paper. Instead we found ourselves with a mediocre camera module which can't take good pics in low light. Nokia had some of the best TFT LCD technologies in creating perfectly legible screens under direct sunlight (my 5610 can be viewed at noon beautifully, and I live in the tropics), but the 5800 had poor sunlight legibility. The unit was released with 369mhz proc, and consequently upgraded to a 434mhz proc speed. Why couldnt they just slapped on a 600mhz proc in the first place? The 5630 had one, and its a lot cheaper than the 5800. See, these little nuances which would have probably been what, a 30-50 dollar difference could have made this thing into something which could have broken the backs of the competition even without kinetic scrolling!

4. I tend to disbelieve that the 5800 has only one year of useability left. The upcoming release of the 5800NE seems to make me believe that. They would want it to sell, and to make it sell, they must give it new features, or make it work real good. The 5800NE has 100% compatible hardware with the 5800XM, and likely as not, same firmware. the 5800 would likely be the first Nokia to go beyond the v31 update (discounting e-series).

5. I bought my 5800 last May.

I believe that Nokia does not intend to make its customers unhappy. Its just deadlines and the large amount of sales they are losing. Its more like their vision is we need to release this NOW!, instead of trying to perfect a phone before it is released.