[tuzz]

Hi Guys,

Very weird problem I am starting to realise.

I have a UK black N97 latest FW 11  and have started to suspect that it seems that when on loudspeaker, the other party can not hear me unless they stop speaking first.

i.e

If they speak and finish talking, then I reply = no issue

BUT

If they speak and I comment or talk as they are speaking, they actually cannot hear me unless they are not speaking. As long as their is a dialogue, anything I say seems to be unheard.

In other words it seems to be working as a half duplex speakerphone.

Please can some people do some tests and get back to me to see if this is a problem common to others or if its a hardware problem that I need to get looked at?

I also wanted to add that this is replicated using any application that makes use of the speakerphone (eg normal cell calls is the same issue as Nimbuzz calls)

Thanks guys,

Tuzz

Message Edited by tuzz on 13-Aug-2009 01:46 PM

[el_loco]

Well it's not half-duplex, but it's not full duplex either.

This is a common issue in speakerphones, in order to minimize audio feedback the microphone gain is controlled by an AGC algorithm, there are also some echo cancellation and noise suppression algorithms going on.

So the bottom line is that if you are in a noisy environment the AGC will pretty much disable the microphone when the speakers are ON (i.e. the other party is speaking) and enable it in the silences. OF course if you start speaking it will try to turn up the gain of the microphone just enough to enable you to talk while maybe disabling the speakers for times. Even in a quiet environment the AGC will turn off the mic when the speakers are on.

The resulting effect is that both parties hear cuts or intercuts. This happens with many hands free devices, I haven't noticed the N97 being significantly worse than others at this.

Also, it's not easy to carry out a conversation when both sides speak at the same time

Message Edited by el_loco on 13-Aug-2009 08:34 PM

[greigster]

I have the same problem with my speaker phone when in hands free mode.
When I make or receive a call, I normally put it on hands free, the problem is that if my caller is speaking at the same time as me,whilst the other person is talking,they cannot hear me.It seems as if the loudspeaker on the N97 cuts out the microphone on the N97 so it ends up being a one way conversation as opposed to a duplex conversation where we can both talk and hear at the same time.
I can hear them at the same time as I am talking but they cannot hear me whilst they are talking (a bit like a CB radio). This happens both with the phone open and closed.

The post above suggests that this is normal but I have had many speaker phones including my last one, an N95 8gb and have never come across this problem before whilst using hands free.

Having read many posts on many N97 forums it has only been mentioned by myself and the original poster so I am not so sure that "el_loco" explanation is correct.
Any ideas?

Regards
Greigster

Message Edited by greigster on 13-Aug-2009 09:16 PM

[cesarcesar]

i too feel i have an issue with this. i use speaker phone mode for most of my calls. people are constantly telling me the cant hear me speaking. lamn. can we control this at all?

[adam_177]

I am also having this issue. I had the N95 previously with no issues whatsoever. Does anyone know if Nokia are working on a fix for this issue?

[abhikiwi2]

Exactly... I have got N97 since 2 weeks now and I am repenting my decision.

It has all hi-fi features but doesn't do the basic CALL operations properly. My friends on the other side of call frequently complain that they can't hear some words. If they are talking, my voice drops completely.. So it feels as if I am using walky-talky.

I went to Phone4U on just next day after buying this phone, but they said they haven't got any such complaints. They gave me another box-packed N97 but it has same issues. They wouldn't change it to any other phone or allow me to downgrade my plan even if I am ready to submit my N97 back.

I think they know this glitch with the problem and just want to get rid of their stock.

I want to now check if bluetooth handsfree can sort the problem, in case there is some faulty circuit in the handset. But I am already reading some entries talking about problem with bluetooth.

[hannesmsi]

Hello,

I have the same problem as mentioned above..

I have a N97 Black / Grey (bought in Europe - Netherlands),

When I put a call in handsfree mode (speaker mode), the caller can't hear me at all..

At the local store they told me, I had to wait for the firmware update released in August ---> "V 12.0.024".

(They thought it will fix the problem..)

I've recently (today) updated my device to the new firmware (mentioned above)

But it didn't solve the problem... :-(

The same problem still occurs..

Shame...

What should or can I Do ??????

Please help.. Or Nokia please help!!!???

Greetz..

Message Edited by hannesmsi on 19-Aug-2009 09:58 PM

[jeppo69]

I am having the same issue. 

I can hear people perfectly but they report that they can only hear me intermittantly.  This only happens when I am using loudspeaker and it seems to be worse when there is noise in the background of the person I am calling. 

I have updated my firmware to version 12.0.024 and it doesn't seem to have fixed the problem.

Does anyone know what causes this or if there is a fix on the way?  It's quite frustrating that my top of the line N97's loudspeaker function is outperformed by my two year old 6120 Classic.

Cheers.

[greigster]

This is my post on the Nokiausers.net forum

Whats the best way of arranging repairs on my N97.
The hands free doesn't work.
Normal phone conversation is not clear as the other person keeps asking me to repeat myself,(it could be that I mumble but I don't have problems on other phones)
The Ovi Maps lags so far behind that it is not safe to use whilst driving.
My GPS goes from 0 satellites up to 7 then drops completely and goes back up to 4. When standing still with a clear view of the sky the speed goes up and down.
Since loading up the latest Ovi-maps, my compass has stopped working.
But at least my camera lens is not scratched.
Do I just turn up at a Nokia service centre or do I have to pre-arrange a visit via NokiaUK online.

The update is as follows:-

Phoned up NokiaUK helpline and they took my details of emei number and my problems as above and they told me to take the N97 into a Nokia service centre which I did. When I told the technician what the problems were, he said that they have received a technical bulletin from Nokia that N97 phones with GPS problems had to be sent back to Nokia for repair but he then said that the hands free problem could be fixed by him by replacing the microphone and the speaker but as it had to be sent away to Nokia for the GPS, he would leave it to them to also fix the hands free. So fingers crossed that they will send me a new phone rather than repair my own.
I realy like my N97 and just want it to work properly even if they repair mine or send me a fully refurbished phone that would be fine.
They said it would take 10 working days but often comes back sooner so will update when I get it back.


Regards
Greigster

[naturetech]

Same prob here in Australia, black N97. Speaking to a voda operator, I get her to tap on her mike as I am talking, and her noise overrides my voice to her. Changed phones; same location and time and sim and an old e65--and no probs. Change n97 to a new sim on another network, same location and time to same voda operator, and N97 still has the prob. Seems to me like N97 handsfree circuitry's duplex is not working properly.

[nirel]

Same problem in Israel.  My N97 and other people N97 suffer from the same problem that people on the far-end site cannot hear the speaker.  In particular if the far end person is in a noisy environment. I spoke with the Nokia representative in Israel and It seems to be a known problem, yet with no solution and no concrete commitment as to when it will be solved.  

Nokia provided for years a superb audio quality in their phones in comparison to their far east competitors.  However, in this case the speaker mode is not really working.  Nokia customers should demand that the manufacturer fulfill his obligaion under the gurantee to provide a working phone especially with regards to such an important feature as speaker.  

Nokia should come public ASAP with dates as to when a solution is going to be available.  If Nokia doesn't have a solution, it should recall the devices.   

[terry1738]

Yes I have this problem with my second N97 (the first I returned because of reset issues) in that all the people I phone complain they cant hear when the speakerphone is on.

This is a huge problem for me as I am in my car for long periods and it is forcing me to break the law.

I got this phone in July and have spent a large portion of my life since then trying to get things to work like my N95 which was great.

Now I feel like I am on my own with the N97 as you dont get a 3rd exchange (even if the phone is faulty)

You can speak to some people in India that agree there is a problem (as they cant hear me) so they give me services center telephone numbers in Australia that dont answer. I just spent 3 hours waiting on hold to 3 service centers none of whom answered and the connection came up with an error and hung up.

I also have an issue with voice dialling in that if I dont have at least 3 words in the voice dial it doesnt work at all so prehapes the 2 are related and something to do with the speaker.

I am at my wits end with this phone and what really irks me is all these happy apple iphone users who cant wait to show me how well there phone works in the areas where the N97 doesnt.

I think the phone was released way to early and I object to Nokia using me as test bed for a phone that should not be on sale and does not work in the most critical area - as a phone.

After reading this post with so many users having the same problem it seems impossible that the phone companys are not aware of the issue when just about every user is.

I feel there should be an organisation formed of unhappy nokia N97 users and we mount a legal challange to send every N97 back to Nokia with a full refund maybe that would get something happening.

In the meantime I am approaching the department of Fair Trading to see if I can get the contract quashed as the phone is not fit for the purpose in that i cant use it as phone.

If that does not work some Nokia executive is going to have a very sore rear end as the phone is not that slim.

[greigster]

Hi Terry, as you will see from my previous post, my N97 went away for this problem along with the GPS inaccuracy problem.The phone came back to the service centre last week and sure enough the GPS seemed a lot better giving me accuracy to about 16 yards but the problem with the hands free (simplex/ half duplex) had not been fixed. So it went straight back to Nokia and should be back today at the service centre for me to pick up.

If the phone has not been fixed, I will have to insist on a new phone or my money back and if necessary take it through the UK courts on account of the phone not being fit for purpose.

I will keep you updated as soon as I get some news.

Regards

Greigster

[djquest]

i have the same problem. all the time, people can't hear me when i'm using the loudspeaker. never had the problem with any of my previous nokia phones (during the last 10 years there have been about 10-12 models  - from 5110 to 6500 classic). this is the first phone that i'm having issues with - regarding the speakerphone.

[greigster]

OMG, Just been out to the Nokia repair centre to collect my repaired N97. I phoned first and was informed that the technician had tested it and all was fine.
So got there and picked up the phone, came out and gave the phone a test by phoning my wife. The way I can test the hands free is by me reciting the alphabet and my wife talking to me from her phone at the same time, It is still not working and cuts out the mike on the N97 so that my wife cannot hear me reciting whilst she is talking.
The girl assistant, with whom the technician tested my phone earlier then took my N97 and put in her own Sim card(presumably to prove that the fault was with my Sim). She then phoned her colleague on the office phone and the conversation went something like this:-
Assistant:-Hi Mary i am just testing a customers phone.
Mary:- Yes I can hear you OK.
Assistant:- yes I can hear you also so I think the phone is working OK.
Mary:-yes everything is clear my end.

The assistant then looked up at me with eyes that said  hey customer are you thick or something I can get it to work.
At that point I turned to the technician and asked "does she know that for both of them to talk at the same time then they BOTH NEED TO TALK at the same time"
I then took my phone and demonstrated to her by phoning her office phone and reciting the alphabet and told her to talk at the same time and ...........she got it!
So back it goes tomorrow to Nokia and I have insisted on a replacement, they have said they would ask again and my problem would be elevated to a higher grade Nokia technician blah blah blah.
It should be back in 5 days "but of course there is no guarantee.
The phone is defo not fit for purpose and now I'm off to cut my wrists.

Greigster

Message Edited by greigster on 28-Sep-2009 07:07 PM

[terry1738]

This is really the problem in that we as users of the N97 are not only expected to find the faults we then have to prove they exist and then we are expected to waste large portions of our time phoning around , booking in, arranging couriers or driving to and from service centers to confront, convince and more often then not DEMONSTRATE the fault to people who CLAIM they are TECNICIANS for Nokia.

Since I have had the phone I have had 3 updates of the firmware every day I check if there are software upgrades I read posts to try and solve the issues and write posts to see if these are common problems or just me. In other words I am giving Nokia a VERY large portion of my time FREE of charge.

Now Nokia expected me to drive over 200Km to take the phone to a service center to see if they have to send it away or be replaced only to find from the internet that EVERYONE has the problem and I am wasting my time taking it back.

It is not possible Nokia are not aware of the problem (unless all the Nokia people use Apple iphones because they cant get their N97's to work).

So why isn't Nokia issuing service updates to its service centers? instead of keeping them and us in the dark.

After all the fact the phone does not work as a phone you would expect to be somewhat of an interest to those involved in fixing them.

If they did issue service updates we would not be wasting more time sending the phone back and forward and getting more and more upset. They would simply say "this is a known problem Nokia is working on the issue and it is expected to be fixed in whenever". I could live with that as long as the time period was reasonable.

I understand the pressure Nokia were under to get the N97 released as the iPhone was rapidly eating away their market share and I think the N97 will be a great phone if they can fix these outstanding problems. It is also true most of us have had great satisfaction with previous Nokia product and want to support them.

However this policy of denial is going to blow up in their faces. They need to publish a list of known issues and when they expect they will be fixed.

By doing that if I have an issue I can refer to the list and see there is an issue with, say, speakerphone AND STOP WASTING MY TIME.

[greigster]

OK this is the latest.
After several calls today to and from Nokia Care in Philippines/UK/USA/Europe, (not sure if any of them were telling me truth/ porkies), I had threatened to take them to court and they finally phoned at 5.30pm to inform me that they would be sending me an Returned Mechandise Authority number along with a return freepost label and once I have returned my phone and all the bits that came with it they will send me a brand new N97 and after thinking about it for 2 seconds I have accepted their offer, AKA bottled out. So I should have an N97 that was not made in the first batch hopefully.They also confirmed that it would come with a fresh 2 year warranty and a new 90day trial of Nokia maps with voice guidance.
I had to be very persistent as Nokia fought hard to palm me off with another repair as I was told that company policy is to have 3 chances of repair before they send you a refurb.
It would be nice to wait until they have upgraded their new stock of N97s to Version 20 of the firmware but I only have 30 days from now to send my old phone back.
Well that's all for now.

Regards

Greigster

[terry1738]

Mate, I admire your persistance. It seems companies have a common policy of wearing down the customer till they give up.

Its only the customers that push them to the limit that actualy get anything done and then you have to be pushing the right buttons to worry them.

I still cannot understand why Nokia dont just admit this is an issue and get on with a fix and let us know when that will be but it may be it has legal repercussions if they admit fault.

Christ its a complicated world when all you want is a phone that works like the the one that I had that is now 3 years old .

Anyway good on you and I hope it fixes the issue however my replacement, while fixing all the other problems, had the same speaker phone problem. I think the issue with the maps (gps intermittant) will be resolved in firmware updates as it only started when I got the new version of maps.

The other issue I notice with new maps is it can not seem to find a lot of address's unless I go on line.

I had one **bleep** issue the other day where it found an address then lost it while I was on the way. When I typed in exactly the same address it came up "no match found" GEEEZZZus thats just what you need when your on a busy schedule and your out the back of whoop whoop doing battle with your bloody pretend GPS.

Cheers Terry 

[greigster]

On Friday 2/10/2009 my original N97 came back to the Nokia Hub, which I think is where all repaired phones go to before being distributed back to the various Nokia Service Centres,and has stayed there up until today when I have just received a phone-call from Nokia repair to tell me that the fault with the speakerphone is unrepairable and they are sending me out a refurb unit. Now I cannot get my brand new replacement until I send back my old one, and my old one/refurb will have a different IEMI number compared to the original box. I bet that will confuse them.I don't know if I will see my new N97 anytime this month! I presume that a refurb unit is one that has been previously owned and that has been repaired already. So is my best bet to keep the repaired/refurb or to send it back and get a brand new one with all the possible faults and bugs.

Regards

Greigster

Message Edited by greigster on 06-Oct-2009 01:14 PM

[cesarcesar]

---

greigster wrote:

 the fault with the speakerphone is unrepairable

---

There is no fix for this yet. Your new one will have the same issue still. lamn!